Hello everyone!

We've made some adjustments to ARAM to accommodate the new item system.

Changes:

• Guardian items count as Legendary items for Mythic passives
• Guardian item efficiency increased
• Guardian items sell for 70% of cost rather than 40%
• Guardian's Orb now grants health regen to manaless champions
• Guardian's Blade, with health, AD, and Ability Haste, added
• Nearby minion deaths grant 6 gold rather than 5
• Passive income and kill gold up 10%

Goals:

• Allow players to engage with the Mythic item system and get farther into their builds before games are decided
• Let players delay committing to a Mythic, if desired, until they get a chance to feel out the game
• All champions should have a Guardian's item they feel good about building
• Players don't feel bad delaying their build by buying a Guardian item

Specific tuning is subject to change while on PBE.

Happy to discuss any questions, comments, and feedback here! Enjoy!

rage1212

As a Kha Player on rift, whenever we get Kha in aram, my friends just give him to me. Every time it’s just a free win. I still wonder how people lose with kha in aram

Because they don't have experience with him, like you do! I wouldn't know the first thing to do with him if I got him in ARAM.

RuthlessSlimeStaff

I'd imagine the player itself is more important than the mmr. Lb in the hands of an lb player is a nightmare in aram.

Yeah, that's the tricky part about balancing ARAM in particular. It's really hard to find the balance where assassin mains don't take over the game, but people who roll into the champion can still have fun playing them. In other modes we know that assassin players have opted into it, so that makes things a lot easier.

It's still an imperfect process and we're always trying to make it better!

codester2124

wow super cool insights! i’ve been picking up Kha’zix more after playing against some really good ones and realizing he might be way more viable in ARAM than i had initially thought, so it’s cool to see that suspicion somewhat confirmed.

if you have a chance, is there any data you could provide on Akali? i’ve been scratching my head at her not receiving nerfs when she seems to consistently do so well in games i play with or against her, and the +18%/-15% dmg just feels insane in the hands of a good Akali player. would love to hear if she’s on the radar for nerfs in or or high elo and what the winrate discrepancies for her are between the two

Yeah, Akali came REALLY close to getting a nerf this patch. About as close as you could possibly get without hitting the line. She has a medium size high/low MMR split. She's pretty balanced in low MMR, but RIGHT up against the line of our definition of "OP" in high MMR.

Band_

Nah it’s based on winrates.
The problem is lower MMR games have bad LB players that are making her appear weaker than she is.

Hello! Leblanc actually has a very low split between low/high MMR - she wins 0.5% more games in high MMR than low. (The top 3 are Kha'Zix, Rek'Sai, and Lulu, who all win >7% more games in high MMR)

That being said, we're trying a new framework to incorporate high elo statistics in ARAM, which resulted in the Ezreal, Nidalee, Nocturne, Ryze, Sona, Vayne, and Yorick changes this patch. We're always trying to improve our balancing strategy, and hopefully this iteration will make ARAM games at high ELO more balanced and enjoyable.

alphiebot

I really appreciate you taking the time for a full response! I definitely agree that the kill count would spike hilariously, and you're going to end up with massive characters arriving in lane with a full complement of tools to abuse their lead. I do think the gold/exp rewards for killing level 3 champions could be tuned even further downward, but that might break player expectations and leave players feeling shortchanged when their score doesn't match the expected reward.

But I disagree on the value of the level 1 fights- it's a kind of problem solving that's perfectly unique to URF, and something that definitely evolves and balances itself as a micro-meta evolves, but I don't think that's best for the general player experience right now. There's a possibility that the balance and playtest teams (and to a lesser extent, PBE community) are more experienced and knowledgeable about the general power levels and tactics, so they're reporting a more fulfilling experience than someone who just wants to play the hyperspeed version of their main.

Metatextually, I know player counts spike during worlds as inactive players return or seasonal players return to their migratory nesting grounds, and I don't know if that kind of depth is going to be as fun for them. There's a lower- I don't know how to say this, but "ranked anxiety" but for League as a whole. Coming back after a long break is sometimes emotionally taxing, trying to catch up with the meta and champion changes so you're not a burden on your team or a target for abuse. URF, and rotating game modes, are a "lighter" experience, which I think is invaluable given the universal anxiety in the state of the world. I think there's more value in reducing that crystallized knowledge burden.

If a fed enemy is abusing you with their three abilities, I think there's at least an understanding and fairness to that spectacle. Their power matches their identity- Maokai's more than just sapling artillery, Akali is more than an immobile DPS lawnmower. At least you're getting smacked around by a familiar face.

I agree that it's possible to communicate to your teammates to back down from the toplane brawls, but I think it can be emotionally draining as well. I think there's some evidence here of community frustration with the current state of brawls, but also plenty of people interested in preserving the ritual of the thing (which I am 100% for! if that wasn't entirely clear). I love that idea of dumb rules we all obey, but I don't find the experience fun when I'm playing a character that's at a distinct disadvantage level 1. When tower hugging is unilaterally the best choice for the character I want to play, and my teammates are positioned to railroad over the enemy, there's an inherent frustration and conflict involved. I will absolutely feed my ass off if the rest of the team is fighting, but it's more for moral cohesion and keeping everyone happy than any strategic reason. I truly think we could all use some more levity in our lives right now. There are other avenues for players to puzzle away, suss out personalized optimizations- in TFT, in the upcoming item rework, in the primary SR experience.

I fully admit that my opinion here is skewed by my personal frustrations. Honestly, my main motivation here is that my brother and I have had a hard time finding a game to play together since he moved away, and I'm having trouble convincing him to play League again because he becomes frustrating for all the reasons I've mentioned. But I would really, really appreciate a hard Riot brain-trust group thinking session on the potential merit here. Really- thanks for taking the time to respond!

I definitely see where you're coming from. The toplane brawl is a very interesting case for sure, because people just started doing it and it snowballed from there. In case you don't know, in Korea they actually do the same thing but in the midlane!

If it helps, I've definitely experienced more success calling off the toplane fight as a duo. If only 3 out of 5 are there most players will be a lot more cautious.

PotmArrows

What are your thoughts on Samira basically playing Urf all the time in SR with the exception of her W cd lol

I think she's a dope champion and I can't wait to see what pros will do with her. I think she's a great addition to the roster.

Gulstab

I think the main argument here is comparing URF to ARAM which does start you at level 3.

The two game modes are oddly similar in some ways. They’re both generally played to be fast-paced or quicker games compared to SR. They both de-emphasize CSing and favour brawling it out. Now ARAM tends to have a bit more nuance in that you try to time your engages with ally cooldowns vs enemy cooldowns because it’s theoretically a permanent 5v5 and your skills aren’t on insanely short timers whereas URF can be XvX depending on tons of factors and fighting any chance you can is seen as optimal because there’s little repercussion for blowing a (normally) big ability.

The other major differences between the two being ARAM is always on a single lane map with no meaningful objectives outside of structures but has access to a 40s~ engage skill to break stalemates and allow certain champions to not feel awful; while URF has access to the cannon, short cooldowns and respawn timers, and no linear objectives assuming the average game doesn’t just push one lane every time.

Perhaps the EXP and gold issues are valid reasons against it but the more dangerous level ones shouldn’t be a drastic difference. It puts both teams on equal ground in the sense that neither team has a more powerful single ability determining the outcome of early game while also just being ridiculously more fun by erasing the tedium of getting to level 3 hoping that you get it before or at the same time as the enemy laner(s).

Could you imagine going back to ARAM pre-Howling Abyss when you had to wait to hit level 3 and finally get to contribute to the game? Maybe the enemy team has a lot of poke or hooks while you’re stuck with close range targeted mobility skills or a single 10s skill that doesn’t even compare in distance to theirs. Hell there’s still a minority of champions who don’t feel meaningful until level 6 on ARAM!

I think if pick!URF is going to continue to return in the coming years it would be worth at least experimenting with a level 3 start. It just lets you get to the fun part of the game faster!

I think the level 3 start makes more sense in ARAM because you really don't have any option besides engaging with the other team. The terrain makes it so.

In URF, why should the teams be on equal ground at level 1? Part of the skill of LoL is recognizing who is stronger based on the state of the game. If you think the other team will win the level 1 fight, you can always opt out (and try to convince your team to opt out too). For example, in this situation I've found success pinging danger a bunch and getting into the cannon first and going mid or bot. That sends a strong signal that I don't intend to do the toplane fight and it often (not always of course) dissuades my team from engaging.

I understand that many champs don't feel that fun until level 3, but I still think that's an important part of the texture of laning in LoL. Starting at level 3 would make some champions more fun, and others that are better in the early levels less so. Since it removes nuance from the game, I'd ne...

Whattahei

Please don’t listen to the monkeys on reddit complaining that their favorite champs sucks at level ONE in a fun mode.

Well, considering that the TLDR of my reply is "I disagree with OP," I don't think you need to worry :-P

That being said, it's my job to make the game more fun if I can!

TheeOmegaPi

Beyond the issues outlined in the parent, I think it's worth noting that having 3 available at the start means a much less "un-fun" few minutes of the beginning of laning outside of the top lane fiesta. Being a melee champ solo at mid against a Syndra/Lux is absolutely miserable when only one ability is there for me. Malphite is a great example of this: If I'm going solo Malph mid (because top and bot have duo premades), I have to make a decision in the form of:

1. Do I want waveclear with my E to ensure that I can possibly level up quicker/get some more gold? OR

2. Do I want some poke with my Q so that I can chip away at my opponent and prevent them from snowballing but miss out on gold?

An instant level 3 would give solo melee laners just a bit more tools for their kit to compete against control mages who wield near-infinite lockdown.

Control mages don't gain that lockdown until they have their full combo, though. All Syndra can do at lv1 is spam Q or W, and Lux either takes Q first (which lets you hide behind minions) or E first (meaning she's almost guaranteed to push the wave so you can pick it up at your tower)

The fundamentals of laning in URF aren't that different from regular Summoner's Rift. In my experience it's totally viable to play safe until you hit your spike, especially given that freezes are almost unheard of.

Hello! A little late to this thread so this comment might be buried, but some thoughts (as a designer on Modes team) -

I'm not convinced starting champions at level 3 would solve this issue. You correctly point out that people would probably still go top lane and scrap it out. I think a group of level 3 champions doing this is worse for a couple of reasons:

• Since all champions can combo, the top lane fight would have much higher lethality
• Higher level champions are worth more experience, so the winners of that fight would have a much bigger advantage
• You can argue that, if starting at level 3, the losing team has more tools to escape their disadvantage. However, this same argument applies to the winning team - they are also higher level and much more dangerous, so they'd be better at pressing their advantage.

I agree that the toplane pileup sometimes puts you in a bad situation, like starting E on Lillia rather than Q. Those fights also have a completely unique texture that you c...

RaphtotheMax5

Yeah starting level 3 would help a lot, a ton of champs are super gated until they get all their abilities

Hello! This should be a top level comment but given that I'm pretty late to this thread, I figured I'd also post it as a reply to this comment for more visibility. Some thoughts as a designer on the Modes team -

I'm not convinced starting champions at level 3 would solve this issue. You correctly point out that people would probably still go top lane and scrap it out. I think a group of level 3 champions doing this is worse for a couple of reasons:

• Since all champions can combo, the top lane fight would have much higher lethality
• Higher level champions are worth more experience, so the winners of that fight would have a much bigger advantage
• You can argue that, if starting at level 3, the losing team has more tools to escape their disadvantage. However, this same argument applies to the winning team - they are also higher level and much more dangerous, so they'd be better at pressing their advantage.

I agree that the toplane pileup sometimes puts you in a bad situation, like star...

Alex_441

Do we have any informations on old items return? In the last run of Nexus Blitz there were more old items like DFG and Ghostwalkers

Will they come back?

Yes, we're working on bringing them back

adimariss

Kogmaw (and possibly other champions if certain conditions are met, based on other replies) in Prize Fight breaks the event, causing it to never end. Apparently, if both people die at the same time (-> Kog passive killing the enemy) the event causes to go on and on until the game ends itself.

As surrender option is broken as well, we're being held hostage.

Should be fixed today!

xEpixxxx

Hi, so I encountered a bug with Syndra today in Nexus Blitz. The syndra simply W'ed our nexus and she could take it anywhere. Clip of it , uploaded on YT by me : https://youtu.be/xjPFIkSQvYU

Should be fixed today!

infinitedodge

Why no full AP nexus blitz exclusive item? Without DFG playing APs is pretty boring

Working on bringin this back!

[deleted]

[deleted]

Should be fixed today!

DartExplosion10

Cool! Do you have any update on Ivern and Mordekaiser being disabled?

They will remain disabled for the time being.

Pakwan___

I’ve found a bug where you can use the cannons in the jungle and bot lane to transport you anywhere you want. Is this intended?

No, they should have fixed firing positions. Can you tell me more about how this happened?

[deleted]

[deleted]

Thank you for the report!