I mean this is gonna get buried at this point, and I'm not here to debate the state of Yuumi (I agree with most the points anyways).

Disabling champions is a joint venture by esports and Design. It's actually primarily Design's call on whether a new rework is disruptive enough to be disabled for early patches (see midscopes, new champions, etc).

My tweet was more directed on that Champs/SR gave the same feedback to esports to disable these champions for MSI, and that the displayed graphic showed a different story that funnels more negativity into the topic.

Even the post-release results tell a similar story, even though the details and lead-up to each one is different. These champs (and a lot of new releases) are highly risky for competitive tournaments, ESPECIALLY global events.

kidexz

Nerfing force of nature is a mistake and we will just go back to tanks having nothing good to build vs magic damage.

We want there to be an outlet to heavy magic dealers (Cassio/Azir/Ryze) that have low downtime. So if FoN doesn't meet that we should tune it up.

But 1 item shouldn't this sharply counter normal burst AP, since softer MR purchase (Merc's) + tank HP stacking is already a good counter to cooldown-based mages.

Proxnite

GalaxySmash promised me smart targeting on Noct’s E so I stop fearing minions randomly when someone’s standing in a wave like 8 patches ago, can you please walk across the office and mildly inconvenience him for me?

I just yelled at him for you. Which means I'll probably get a bug ticket from him.

I'm here for overreactions and hot takes.

ARandomAshenOne

Can we expect a return to bruiser renekton with some compensations to help him feel better when he's being a "meatball" or will you be still focusing on him being a pseudo-assassin?

Yep this is the intention for Reksai and Renekton. Theyve turned into assassins as their "best winrate" build with Prowler's which means that without massive kit adjustments, their bruiser builds became really bad.

This was one of the big reasons why we wanted to remove the dash from Prowler's, since it ended up warping the kits to be so different than originally intended (and what most players associate the champion with).

Syliann

Ornn at MSI confirmed. So blessed

MSI is on 13.8 so no gigachad ornn

Whatever4M

Some games it's really bad to go tank sion and ad Sion is much better. But this is not relevant to my question, people build ad Sion because its fun, are these off meta builds being considered with the claw changes?

AD Sion existed before Prowler's and we will support it as a secondary build, but not better than the tank build.

Pigwick123

guys the dash is being removed from prowerls, aka reksai is being removed from the game lol

We've flagged a few champs that have been balanced around the dash and expect to buff/adjust them on the same patch or on the following one.

Balancing around 1 unhealthy dash that polarizes your kit and balance state usually isn't the best place. Currently Talon (who at least has somewhat competitive secondary options), Renekton, and Rek'Sai are among the most warped by Prowler's right now.

truthordairs

Since Ornn’s release he had a bug where his knock ups were effected by tenacity- which isn’t supposed to happen. They fixed it last patch which made him skyrocket in winrate.

Yep, we debated if we wanted to nerf him for 13.9 to keep it power neutral, but wanted to verify that the bugfix didn't introduce other bugs. This is kinda one of the hard things about having to lock patches about ~5 days after the previous patch goes live.

But at this stage it does appear that most of the power was adding about ~0.5s of CC or more to his combos. So expect adjustments in 13.10/13.11 if he stays up in the 53s.

cryge

I'm down to make Teemo unpurchaseable until we figure this out

Some insight into the "Why is X priced?". Short answer, the dartboard told us to.

Long answer, we had a few principles when deciding new prices.

• Avoid price increases, this should be a beneficial experience to players since the old model was a bit outdated
• Try to match difficult/approachability when possible. Obviously some old champs will be cheap even if a bit complex/weird due to the above rule.
• Try to include champs that are approachable BUT also can show you what League of Legends can be. While you may go 0-20 on Yasuo, it's pretty clear to see how you could easily fall in love with the champ and keep play to only go 0-10 next time.
• Provide a variety of options for each role. Just like the above, if you're a top laner, we want you to find the best champion for you at a low price point without a BE penalty for "exploring".

Hi, thanks for bringing this up.

We expect to have the cup displayed by the time the rework launches in 13.5. We temporarily hid the VFX as we work on it to fit in the new ult's 5 panels. So expect it to be back!

Yami_No_Kokoro

Or they have a completely inaccurate read on either the actual issues involved or what is or isn't optimal or typical of the class involved. The fact he unironically said "and right now they're all funneled into mana burst mythic into zhonyas + rabadons" gives me zero faith any changes or adjustments will be handled well. Practically no "stereotypical" mages go Zhonya's second, and practically no one who is trying to win goes Deathcap third because it's horrible (most expensive item in the game with no notably spiky components and either breaks even or outright loses to Void or Shadowflame third, which are also blatantly cheaper).

This is where twitter brevity is bad.

That build SUCKS as you'll have no haste and be stuck on bad backs for most of the game.

The main point is that Mages need to build damage to be relevant. But will eventually need both Pen and some defensive (usually zhonya's) to be relevant lategame. This funnels your build extremely quickly into the same items every game. That's not bad if the items are exciting and different from champ to champ. Currently, that's not the case as most mages items say "AP statstick and generic damage up" without much deviation.

PANIC SELL BLUE ESSENCE SHARDS

We call this patch "The Anti-Bird Patch"

Anivia, Azir, and Phoenix Udyr sadge

RinViri

I had to switch mains cause he does 0 damage early

Not sure how you can justify this, when his dmg combo at lvl 6 does:

485-590 (+ 500-600% bAD) physical dmg. This is without any autoattacks, and Lee easily gets 2-3 autos off. Nothing short of a full armor tank survives this early game.

You can argue Lee is weak, but you can't argue his dmg is low, because these numbers are insanely high.

I didn't do the Lee change, but this is one where I have to jump in and point out something that's pretty frustrating. You phrase this is "not sure how you can justify this" and then list out the damage (for sake of time I'll just assume the numbers you posted are correct).

Let's take the most picked jungler in Plat+ Maokai. At level 6, Maokai has 1060 HP and 60 Armor (~38% damage reduction). Lee Sin at 6 items likely has 40-60 bAD (~150 total AD). So if Lee Sin hits literally every ability and maximizes damage with 3 autos, that's ~850 damage to Maokai with 0 items. Reduced even further if Maokai is allowed to spend the 2-3k gold Lee Sin spent.

Yes listing numbers is great, but saying they're objectively large without a comparison makes no sense.

Now the subjective part is how much damage should Lee Sin be allowed to do in an average game state with a full combo. That's a tough question, but to confidently say that his current damage is consistently killing everything is blatantl...

PM_Cute_Ezreal_pics

I respect that phreak is actually open about what yuumi is.

I have no problem with Yuumi being a beginner champion, but if that's their intention she should be priced at 450BE, not 6.3k

That's a very steep price for a new player with no champions, especially since she isn't even one of the free champs you get from leveling a new account

This is something we agree with and I fully believe that our pricing model is outdated.

August and I are working on updating the BE pricing for a lot of champs to better fit modern standards and to also address some of these things. If Yuumi is meant to be an easy-to-access champion........she should probably be obtainable early.

I will apologize in advance for the likely host of polish bugs that will probably appear on launch. We've had a bunch of passionate devs piecing together what we can with this micropatch, which notably does not let us change key things such as tooltips or some scripts. So a lot of tooltips and things may seem off at first.

These should be corrected whenever we get the chance, and surely by the next patch. But for now, assume what's in the patch notes is what should be in-game (even if the exact descriptions in-game don't match). Thanks for understanding!

The audacity to say Tim instead of Mr. XY